Oral History Benchmark - Sophia Angelis

Interview with my white neighbor Kathy Rigby, about her experiences with the Civil Rights Movement and discrimination. Sunday, May 18, 2014 at 1:30.

SA: Hi, how are you today?

KR: I’m just fine, how are you?

SA: Good, thank you.

KR: Great.

SA: Okay, to start off, when were you born?

KR: When was I born? I was born in 1950, mid-century.

SA: In what area did you grow up in?

KR: I grew up in South Texas. I was born in San Antonio, lived there ‘til I was 5. We moved to Laredo, Texas and we moved back when I was 15, back to San Antonio.

SA: So, all in the South?

KR: All in South Texas, right.

SA: What is your conceptualization of race and how it has changed?

KR: Well, I think race, to me, it’s more of a definition than anything else. I mean you have people who are of African descent. You have white non-hispanics, they are hispanics but that’s not really a race, that’s an ethnicity. But I feel that these are labels for various purposes but, to me, all people are the same under the skin and I wish that somehow we could get away from classifying people by race. Although, I understand it’s necessary from time-to-time, but I think that continuing classifying people like that just continues to exacerbate the problems that exist with racism.

SA: Mmhmm. And let’s go back to what you said, when you said you think that it (classifying people by race) should be there during certain times. What do you mean by that?

KR: Oh, well for example, we keep records of various things according to race. For example, we track black infant mortality rates compared to the mortality rates for other non-black infants. We compare disease. We compare income levels, poverty, educational levels. You know the government and other entities keep track of those sorts of things, but I really think that I’d like for the world to start thinking of us as humanity not races.

SA: Yea, good way to put it! How do you see the role of race in society?

KR: The role of race... Well, I believe in racial and ethnic pride, but, I also think that once again, as a human race, we need to start transcending the labels based on color of skin. If we measure each other, it should not be by race, it should be by the quality of our characters and the kind of humans we are, the kind of people that we are or aspired to be. So I would like to see it play less of a role in society, just in terms of differentiating between groups of people because I don’t think that’s very productive and I think we need to get passed where we look at people according to the color of their skin.

SA: Yea, I like the way you put that! What do you remember from the Civil Rights Movement?

KR: Well, I was a teenager and in early years of college in the 60’s and that was the time when it was a real hotbed! I remember marches and protests. I remember Dr. Martin Luther King and I remember that a lot of people, black, white and otherwise, really made sacrifices in order to help ensure equality of the races. It was a very challenging time, it was a difficult time but it was a very uplifting time because so many people were beginning to see that we had tremendous inequalities and tremendous disparities based on racial lines in this country. There were many people who were willing to stand up, step forward and make sacrifices in order to equalize things. It’s still going on, I mean, we don’t exactly have a movement anymore but the battle for Civil Rights continues today but back then it was a very exciting time because it was a time of change and a time of discontent. There were lots of good people who stepped up and there were lots of people who opposed too. So, I remember a lot of those news stories, things that happened and especially growing up in the South. It was a significant time in American history. I’ll tell you a little side story, my sister graduated from high school in 1967 and one of my mothers friends wanted to have a graduation luncheon for her. She scheduled it at a hotel in San Antonio and one of my sisters friends was black. We found out that they would not -- this was in 1967-- would not serve, would not allow, her black friend to come. My mothers friend was very open-minded and willing to make a change and she changed it to a different venue so that all of my sisters friends could attend regardless of the color of their skin. So, that was as recently as 1967.

SA: Wow!

KR: Yea, isn’t that terrible!

SA: Yea, that’s horrible! I can’t believe they did that!

KR: Yea, that was segregation.

SA: Back then, in 1967?

KR: Yup.

SA: Oh my god.

KR: Yes.

SA: What were your-- you said you attended college at that time, you were a teenager-- what were your educational experiences?

KR: Well, it’s interesting. I started college at the University of Houston Texas. The college itself was physically located in a predominately black neighborhood. I really had not had a lot of exposure to other races when I was growing up, just mostly by geography.

So when I moved to Houston and really started to get to know a lot of other folks, I just had a blast! I just embraced everyone that I met and it didn’t matter to me what color their skin was, we just had a lot of fun together. I experienced new things. All of the cooks at my dorm were African American ladies. So, we had grits every breakfast and greens every dinner, and I learned to love those things! It was just a growing experience for me! I don’t think I was ever really prejudiced but I certainly--it opened up opportunities for me, to meet other kinds of people and I really enjoyed it.

SA: Awww!

KR: I remember it as being a growing experience.

SA: Awww, that’s amazing! I love grits!

KR: Yea, so do I! (Laughter) Wow, mmm! I could use some right now.

SA: Right! (Laughter)